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It ain't the go, its the stop

Last post 10-03-2006, 1:22 PM by jcloonan. 3 replies.
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  •  09-29-2006, 3:19 PM 94

    It ain't the go, its the stop

    The focus on power and acceleration (its simplist incarnation being the division of crash data by engine size) ignores several indicators that would seem to suggest vehicle weight as the factor in crashes. Consider:
    1. Most crashes happen while decellerating.
    2. Most crashes happen while braking.
    3. Even the smallest motorcycles are able to attain speeds at which fatality is likely.
    4. Bikes in the over 1,000 cc category have substantially less power and less acceleration than bikes in the literbike class.
    5. Bikes in the over 1,000 cc category can weigh twice as much as bikes in every smaller class.
    6. The largest, heaviest bikes do not come equipped with better brakes or more adhesive tires; often the opposite is true. In the best cases they have similar brakes to the shortest stopping bikes.
    Obviously, weight isn't the entire story, by itself. But isn't it time we reevaluated the data based on bike weight?
    -- Jim

  •  10-02-2006, 10:40 AM 121 in reply to 94

    Re: It ain't the go, its the stop

    Consider:
    1. Most crashes happen while decellerating.
    2. Most crashes happen while braking.
    There's one problem with those two statements. They seem to imply that the crash is an effect of deceleration or braking, while they may be an effort to avoid or mitigate the crash circumstances.
    4. Bikes in the over 1,000 cc category have substantially less power and less acceleration than bikes in the literbike class.
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't you mean here that "Bikes in the under 1,000 cc category have substantially less power and less acceleration than bikes in the liter bike class?"  
    6. The largest, heaviest bikes do not come equipped with better brakes or more adhesive tires; often the opposite is true. In the best cases they have similar brakes to the shortest stopping bikes.
    Just to add some more data to this, these figures represent the top 10 shortest 60-0 stopping distances tested by Motorcycle Consumer News (Dec. 2003 issue). There are some pretty hefty bikes here, like the VTX and V-Rod.

    1. 1999 Triumph Speed Triple 106.7'
    2. 1997 Suzuki Marauder 800 107.6'
    3. 1997 Yamaha YZF600R 108.2
    4. 1998 Ducati 750 Monster 109.1
    5. 1998 Suzuki TL1000S 109.4
    6. 2002 Honda VTX 1800 109.5
    7. 2002 Harley V-Rod 109.5
    8. 1998 Buell M2 Cyclone 109.6
    9. 2003 Triumph Speed 4 109.7
    10. 2002 Ducati Monster S4 109.8
    Obviously, weight isn't the entire story, by itself. But isn't it time we reevaluated the data based on bike weight?
    I'm not sure this is going to get you to the place you think it will, since at one end of the spectrum you're going to have a lot of cruisers, and the other end you're going to have a pile of sportbikes. A lot of the 600cc class sportbikes are going outpower even the larger cruisers.

  •  10-03-2006, 12:48 PM 145 in reply to 121

    Re: It ain't the go, its the stop

    And something I have been discussing with a riding buddy:  how many folks actually PRACTICE stopping from hghway speeds?  I didn't and it sent me over the hood of a Honda.   Similar to the video posted elsewhere.   Revisiting the scene, I possibly had enough room to stop my 02 Vstrom in the distance provided, at least according to the figures provided by the m/c mags.   BUt the reality is that the car entered my path and I was unable to stop in the distance provided  Can your average rider stop in the published braking distances under controlled circumstances?   Much less in real life?

    I was fortunate to have practioced stopping enough to get it slowed to a speed that I did not slide or injure myself any worse than what occurred upon initial contact.

     And I would say that the 1000cc + category has too many different types of bikes to develop a correlation.   A 1300cc Hayabusa is going to stop MUCH differently than a 1500 cc Electra Glide.  Power ratings different, etc.  How can these things be compared?

     Rando

  •  10-03-2006, 1:22 PM 151 in reply to 145

    Re: It ain't the go, its the stop

    I think this is where racing schools and track days provide a great benefit to street riding. If you really want to post good lap times, you have to learn to brake well, efficiently, and at the last possible moment. I can't think of a better way to learn to use your brakes in an emergency situation.
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